Countershaft sprocket seal


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BillB
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by BillB »

Not quite another 9 years, but more like 2 -1/2 years later I was perusing the site and can report that the seal is still holding up well. That's more than 25 years since I replaced it, longer than the original seal lasted. If anybody develops a countershaft oil seal leak and needs anything clarified about my shade tree time and aggravation saving seal replacement, feel free to contact me anytime. Cheers and Happy New Year to all.

Bill at billb_msn@msn.com
Last edited by BillB on Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bill
79, 81 & 82 CBXs
Others in the garage: 91 Ducati 917ie, 04 RC51, 05 MV Agusta F4 1000, 09 ST1300
ICOA 2924
Buckeye, AZ

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Jeff Bennetts
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Jeff Bennetts »

Happy New Year Bill!

Looking forward to another countershaft sprocket seal update in 2021.

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BillB
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by BillB »

Well, here's the first installment on the next 9 year report. It's only about 2 years later, but no surprise - the countershaft seal is still good, far outlasting the original one. Did a 220 mile ride today with a local riding club. After some work last week I got rid of the last oil leak and can report there are no new ones. Over the decades I have had leaks from the oil filter housing, cam end covers and an initially puzzling one caused by a pulled case stud (TimeSerting the case resolved that many years ago), as well as the countershaft seal leak. Finally NO spots on the garage floor.
Bill
79, 81 & 82 CBXs
Others in the garage: 91 Ducati 917ie, 04 RC51, 05 MV Agusta F4 1000, 09 ST1300
ICOA 2924
Buckeye, AZ

Barry Moore
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Barry Moore »

This is a hugely relevant topic. I am very grateful for all of the expertise that is so freely shared by such a great group. Thank you very much
Barry -
1981 CBX (restored to factory original)
2002 CB750 (chrome 4 into 1 Vance & Hines full exhaust, several Denali light sets)
2013 CB1100 (bone stock)

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by pmcburney »

I have just gone through the removal shenanigans on my CBX of this seal - I eventually got it out after many hours of drilling holes, levering, swearing and destruction of the old seal.

Had I read this thread beforehand, I would have been better prepared, mentally at least...

It beggars belief that a manufacturer would specify such a fitment arrangement for a seal that just doesn't require it given the low pressure of oil in the gearbox and the seal's location above the oil level at rest, at least while the bike is on its centre stand.
To get this seal replaced 'correctly' would ordinarily require case-splitting - a job done by a dealer or mechanic that would cost thousands of dollars in labour for what is essentially a tens-of-dollars part.

Most other manufacturers specify a standard push-fit, non-lipped seal for the exact same application that works and seals exceptionally well and can easily be replaced.

Why this, Honda?

Why?

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Dynamohum »

I think your question is falling on deceased ears.

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by pmcburney »

Dynamohum wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2024 8:42 pm
I think your question is falling on deceased ears.
Indeed.

daves79x
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by daves79x »

First of all, these seals RARELY leak - ever. But none are 100% leakproof. I would never replace that seal this way. It can be replaced the right way in less than a day's work. But if you don't want to do the work, or can't, and don't want to pay someone to do it, I guess this is your option. Your bikes, do as you wish. And if you're looking for an explanation as to why Honda did that, good luck. They had reasons when they designed it. And having every Tom, Dick and Harry be able to change it easily wasn't one of them. This is one of the least head-scratching things they've done. Owning and maintaining one is neither easy nor cheap.

Dave

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by CBX-tras »

+1 to what Dave said.

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Dynamohum »

Barry Moore wrote:
Wed May 24, 2023 3:26 pm
This is a hugely relevant topic. I am very grateful for all of the expertise that is so freely shared by such a great group. Thank you very much
The ‘expertise’ can be damned discouraging too.

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by pmcburney »

daves79x wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2024 7:25 am
First of all, these seals RARELY leak - ever. But none are 100% leakproof. I would never replace that seal this way. It can be replaced the right way in less than a day's work. But if you don't want to do the work, or can't, and don't want to pay someone to do it, I guess this is your option. Your bikes, do as you wish. And if you're looking for an explanation as to why Honda did that, good luck. They had reasons when they designed it. And having every Tom, Dick and Harry be able to change it easily wasn't one of them. This is one of the least head-scratching things they've done. Owning and maintaining one is neither easy nor cheap.

Dave
First of all, I refuse to apologise for wanting to be able to easily and inexpensively repair anything I own, not least a CBX.

"Less than a day's work"
I'd pay to see that - fully assembled, running and leaking to fully assembled, running and not leaking in less than 8 hours.
Film the next one you do.
By yourself.
Go on.

"Owning and maintaining one is neither easy nor cheap."
You make it sound like this is somehow a good or noble thing that only truly righteous owners of CBXs 'understand'.

Why can't, through practical design, anything mechanical be easy and inexpensive to work on and repair?
Or, are CBX owners so blinded by their own misguided sense of superiority over other models and marques that they're willing to accept objectively poor and largely unworkable design decisions for ongoing maintenance as some sort of holy 'gospel' of Honda, never to be questioned?

You don't also own a Ducati by any chance?

Or a John Deere tractor?

daves79x
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by daves79x »

It IS easily doable in a day, I've done it 3 or 4 times, not to replace the seal, but to go even deeper. It would be ready to run at the end of the day, but I wouldn't until the next day, just to let the case sealant dry. No matter how hard you wish these were different, or easier to service, doesn't make it so. Ask the guy who owns the CBX I just spent a year, off and on, trying to find an oil leak. I found it finally, but it was neither easy nor cheap. The engine was apart 5 times. You are perfectly free to ignore my comments and carry on.

Dave

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by CBX-tras »

Notice that is says "ICOA Technical Director" under Dave's name on the right. He's a highly knowledgeable and respected member of the CBX community.
I regard his contributions on the subject as gospel.

These bikes are not lawn mowers, they require the patience and understanding similar to working on a vintage Ferrari.
I've found that there are no shortcuts.

But don't let that stop you.

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Jeff Bennetts
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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Jeff Bennetts »

I have seen Dave strip and reassemble a CBX motor in the parking lot of the Marlinton Motor Inn several times over the years during a couple different ICOA National Rallies. So yes it can be done without much drama if you are as skilled, knowledgeable and experienced as Dave and have all the bits at hand.

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Re: Countershaft sprocket seal

Post by Rick Pope »

Well, I don't have a Ducati, but I do have a Moto Guzzi, and several John Deeres. What Dave says is the cold hard facts. And If he says he can do a job in a certain time allotment, it's because he's done it.
Rick Pope
Either garage is too small or we have too many bikes. Or Momma's car needs to go outside.

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