Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

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Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby rperacing » Mon Oct 10, 2016 5:08 pm

Hello,

We are RPE Racing out in Bathurst, Australia - long time CBX fans and modifiers.

I would like to share our latest creation, a 1350 big bore, fuel injected streetfighter CBX.

This is a customer's project in which we did most frame modifications (speed triple front and rear end), big bore kit, EFI installation and tuning.

Redline is 10.000, hp is 130 at the rear tire. This bike still has fairly mild cams...and is very well mannered! It sounds glorious!! Nothing like a 6 into 1!

Enjoy and let us know what you think :text-thankyouyellow: :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7f6QeQ ... s&index=24

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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby steve murdoch icoa #5322 » Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:25 pm

The bike sounds great!
Seems to rev clean with no hesitation all the way up and also on the way down.
I bet it is fun to ride, although you do need to find some nicer roads. Pothole City.
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby rperacing » Mon Oct 10, 2016 10:21 pm

Thanks a lot, it is indeed well behaved...I guess you can thank fuel injection for that

:text-thankyouyellow:
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby NobleHops » Tue Oct 11, 2016 6:56 pm

Epic.

Just put the touch on your post to embed your video. Thanks for posting!
I Do Vapor Blasting! http://www.cbxclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9881

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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby rperacing » Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:08 pm

Thanks a lot!

You've earned yourself a BONUS!!! :laughing-rollingyellow:

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This is not the end of the line...this is a mild road engine that idles at 1000 rpm all day.
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Thu Oct 13, 2016 8:07 am

Sweet, do you have any build photos you could post up?
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Syscrush » Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:41 am

Magnificent.

My long-term plans for my CBX include EFI. What version of Haltech ECU and what throttle bodies & injectors did you use?

Did you have to upgrade the charging/electrical system to keep up with the fuel pump?

What would you charge for a set of parts ready for installation and tuning?
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby rperacing » Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:26 am

Syscrush wrote:Magnificent.

My long-term plans for my CBX include EFI. What version of Haltech ECU and what throttle bodies & injectors did you use?

Did you have to upgrade the charging/electrical system to keep up with the fuel pump?

What would you charge for a set of parts ready for installation and tuning?


Sprint 500 ECU - basic but effective

Throttle bodies of some Jap bike but highly modified. Very labour intensive. LS1 injectors

Charging system is fine 14+V even at idle. The whole EFI might draw 5 Amps, not much more.

The starter is a problem trying to turn a High comp 1350...when cold all good, when hot not so cool. We are working on a solution.

At the moment we cannot offer those parts. We though about it, but cannot commit.

On the other hand, heard you were looking for a BB kit :teasing-poke:
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Syscrush » Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:09 am

I have all of my BB stuff in hand already, thanks. And I'm not willing to go as large as you guys are, although I definitely respect what you're doing!

LS1 injectors seem like a bit much for a 130 whp engine.

I was thinking that a good donor (in terms of air / fuel flow and hp) for my engine would be Suzuki GSX650F - just about the least powerful I4 EFI engine I can find. They make a bit over 70 whp from 4 cylinders, so 3/4 of a rack times 2 works out to ~105 whp. My target is in the 90's somewhere, so to me that seems like about the right size. No idea if they'd physically fit in terms of spacing, height, or depth, though. And I'd like to keep the stock airbox - even if it needs some mods. And I would want to go closed-loop so I can run a catalytic converter. The desire for the cat is actually the driver for my interest in EFI on this bike.

Maybe all that is crazy but if it's possible that would be my ideal setup.

I'm very pleased to see what you've done with this machine - keep up the good work!!!

EDIT: As for solving the starter issues - I'm sure you've thought of this but it seems to me that you have 4 broad options:

1. Run heavier cables to the relay and starter, maybe try to source a relay with less voltage drop and clean/rebuild the starter. Might give you that small boost that you need.
2. Re-wind the starter for more torque (would probably decrease the cranking speed, which might not matter so much with an EFI setup).
3. Add a compact Li-Ion battery and wire it so that it's in series with the main batt when the starter relay is activated, but in parallel otherwise. That would give you 24V to the starter but 12V to everything else in normal operation. This carries the risk of frying your ECU or other electronics but it might be doable.
4. Fit a more powerful starter from a different bike, like a Harley that is super hard to crank. Depending on what's out there and how much you like machining, this might be the hardest or the easiest approach.
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:30 pm

Syscrush wrote:
I'm very pleased to see what you've done with this machine - keep up the good work!!!

EDIT: As for solving the starter issues - I'm sure you've thought of this but it seems to me that you have 4 broad options:

1. Run heavier cables to the relay and starter, maybe try to source a relay with less voltage drop and clean/rebuild the starter. Might give you that small boost that you need.
2. Re-wind the starter for more torque (would probably decrease the cranking speed, which might not matter so much with an EFI setup).
3. Add a compact Li-Ion battery and wire it so that it's in series with the main batt when the starter relay is activated, but in parallel otherwise. That would give you 24V to the starter but 12V to everything else in normal operation. This carries the risk of frying your ECU or other electronics but it might be doable.
4. Fit a more powerful starter from a different bike, like a Harley that is super hard to crank. Depending on what's out there and how much you like machining, this might be the hardest or the easiest approach.


Or a compression release on a cylinder or two?
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby rperacing » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:43 pm

Syscrush wrote:I have all of my BB stuff in hand already, thanks. And I'm not willing to go as large as you guys are, although I definitely respect what you're doing!

LS1 injectors seem like a bit much for a 130 whp engine.

I was thinking that a good donor (in terms of air / fuel flow and hp) for my engine would be Suzuki GSX650F - just about the least powerful I4 EFI engine I can find. They make a bit over 70 whp from 4 cylinders, so 3/4 of a rack times 2 works out to ~105 whp. My target is in the 90's somewhere, so to me that seems like about the right size. No idea if they'd physically fit in terms of spacing, height, or depth, though. And I'd like to keep the stock airbox - even if it needs some mods. And I would want to go closed-loop so I can run a catalytic converter. The desire for the cat is actually the driver for my interest in EFI on this bike.

Maybe all that is crazy but if it's possible that would be my ideal setup.

I'm very pleased to see what you've done with this machine - keep up the good work!!!

EDIT: As for solving the starter issues - I'm sure you've thought of this but it seems to me that you have 4 broad options:

1. Run heavier cables to the relay and starter, maybe try to source a relay with less voltage drop and clean/rebuild the starter. Might give you that small boost that you need.
2. Re-wind the starter for more torque (would probably decrease the cranking speed, which might not matter so much with an EFI setup).
3. Add a compact Li-Ion battery and wire it so that it's in series with the main batt when the starter relay is activated, but in parallel otherwise. That would give you 24V to the starter but 12V to everything else in normal operation. This carries the risk of frying your ECU or other electronics but it might be doable.
4. Fit a more powerful starter from a different bike, like a Harley that is super hard to crank. Depending on what's out there and how much you like machining, this might be the hardest or the easiest approach.


Thanks!

Ls1 are big but we wanted to be able to run E85 if we wanted to. They are also cheap and plentiful.

Good luck with the throttle bodies. It is a messy job. We thought about a budget solution but nowhere near ready. It would involve a modular design where you join them side by side to whatever pitch you want.

As far as size, keep it above 28/30mm. Why pick the least powerful 4 cylinder? :laughing-rollingyellow:
Good luck keeping the stock airbox!

I hope I am not reading that CAT thing right...why would you do such a blasphemy? Closed loop is not a problem, just added complexity.

The battery solution sounds good but space is at a premium on this bike. We will probably go the long way around and adapt another starter to it.

How would you go about decompression some cylinders?

:text-thankyouyellow:
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:44 am

"Decompression spark plug" Google it! Then search the image link, there's some interesting concepts and products there and then there's always the traditional ways, similar to what's on many old thumpers like my 1979 Yamaha TT500.
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Captain » Sat Oct 15, 2016 2:52 pm

Deleted.....

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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Syscrush » Sat Oct 15, 2016 10:56 pm

rperacing wrote:Ls1 are big but we wanted to be able to run E85 if we wanted to. They are also cheap and plentiful.

That makes sense.

As far as size, keep it above 28/30mm. Why pick the least powerful 4 cylinder? :laughing-rollingyellow:
Good luck keeping the stock airbox!

The one I have in mind is 36mm, should be plenty. I was thinking that the least powerful 4 cylinder with EFI (just over 70 whp) times 1.5 would flow more than enough for a 90-100 whp bike. I'm assuming that going larger than what the bike needs would make it harder to tune, but I'm not an expert in this.

I hope I am not reading that CAT thing right...why would you do such a blasphemy? Closed loop is not a problem, just added complexity.

My interest in a catalytic converter is very simple. Unburned hydrocarbons are toxic and they smell awful, and I'd rather have a bike that doesn't emit quite so much of them. It can be done at no performance cost - modern cats flow so well that we have OEM bikes making in the neighborhood of 200 hp equipped with cats. The setup I'm interested in is the aftermarket Akrapovic inserts that work with their mufflers, like so:

Image

If the EFI can be dialed in well enough to keep from poisoning the catalytic, this setup would allow a very stealthy install. I'd kind of hate to give up my Hindle muffler, but this is a very nice system, IMO and would be worth it if it can be made to work.
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Re: Honda CBX 1350 Fuel Injected - Speakers UP!!

Postby Captain » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:30 pm

Just a small question but with some big reamifications.

The very first thing I ever look at when presented with a Dyno graph is verify that the torque and HP lines cross at 5252 RPM
In order for it to be a valid. In the graph posted earlier in this thread this not the case (the lines are crossing at 7000 RPM)
Please explain why this is ?
For those that are unaware of the importance of this 5252 RPM figure, it is the factor that is fixed in order to calculate HP from a torque figure. Torque is the only thing measured by a Dyno and the HP is a calculation.
If anyone requires verification of this fact and the 5252 RPM requirement, google it for yourselves.

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