'Diamond in the rough'

Hey, what projects are you planning or preparing for? CBX, other motos, workshop, WHATEVAH!

'Diamond in the rough'

Postby bikeymikey748 » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:47 am

Well this is the official beginning, I guess. The 'X' got here yesterday. Looks a bit rough, but I was aware of that going in. Things like this leaking/rusted tank for instance;
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Or perhaps this Mac 6-2 system;
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Looks clean enough I guess. Carbs seem to run well (I'll check for any carb work when I get things apart). Primary chain/clutch basket/alt. clutch all quiet at idle.A bit of valve noise on startup, but that dissapates as the motor warms (Normal ?). Disappointed to see it smoking lighty when the throttle 'blipped', hopefully the bores aren't oxidised & a hone + rings will save it ( I'll swap the valve guide seals at same time).
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Oh man, I've got work to do;
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With the exception of the tank & motor EVERYTHING else in this shot is headed for the shed, as well as the entire front & rear end.;
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I got 'dinged' a bit in an accident a month ago and can't swing any wrenches for a bit longer, PLUS I have a few repairs (painting mostly) to do on the SR. THEN I'm 'goin in'. Big plus was that the bike was already plated & I don't ever have to pass mechanical inspection again , as long as I keep the registration current.
Stay tuned !
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby NobleHops » Wed Sep 07, 2011 12:00 pm

:text-goodpost: :text-thankyouyellow:

All of us that did what you are doing are secretly jealous of your upcoming journey. I have a gnarly project of my own queued up for this winter, and I am approaching it with a 50/50 mixture of excitement and dread. But no hijacks here, really glad you're going to share it with us and you'll get as much help as I am able to give you personally.

N.
Nils Menten
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'80 CBX, sort-of restored :-)

http://noblehops.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/The-Not-Restoration-of-My/5334012_jN2Rnx
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby zxbob » Thu Sep 08, 2011 12:12 am

Or perhaps this Mac 6-2 system;
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Throw that thing as far as you can !

There was a "Mac" on my 82 when I bought it - I replaced it with an RC 6 into 2, it was like getting a whole new bike !
I know you'll love it when your done. The CBX is worth every bit of effort you put into it.

Bob
Good parts aint cheap ~ and cheap parts aint good !
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby daves79x » Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:31 am

There are some really cool things you can do with a naked late model (CBX, that is). They take on a whole new personality when you remove the bags and fairing. They are actually a very nice handling package that way. Congrats and keep us posted and ask questions. If you are contemplating something, it's probably been done before - so take advaqntage of all the experience here!

Dave
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby EMS » Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:40 am

daves79x wrote:There are some really cool things you can do with a naked late model (CBX, that is). They take on a whole new personality when you remove the bags and fairing. They are actually a very nice handling package that way. Dave

..and I am one of the few who L O V E the Prolinks WITH the fairing and bags and I don't think it takes away too much from the handling. After all, you are probably on public roads, most of the time. Not on the track.

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To be misunderstood is the rule.
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby bikeymikey748 » Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:38 am

..and I am one of the few who L O V E the Prolinks WITH the fairing and bags and I don't think it takes away too much from the handling. After all, you are probably on public roads, most of the time. Not on the track.



All very true, and I always like the lines of the fairing. But...I want the Mighty 6 cylinder to stand out prominently. I find the stock bodywork masks the motor. I also like the lines of the early model tanks better too, but 'in the flesh' the late model tanks look quite 'organic', nice!

Congrats and keep us posted and ask questions. If you are contemplating something, it's probably been done before - so take advaqntage of all the experience here!


Oh man, am I going to ask questions, thanks so much for being so willing to help out. I'm really impressed with the cummunity atmosphere on the site.
One of the major issues I expect will be fitting the late model GSXR 1000 rear arm & mono +++ sprocket alignment. I mean, its keeping me up nights! I found this X on the net, at the risk of offending anyone, I really like what he accomplished. Its interesting how he overbuilt the rear frame to support the upper shock mount. I don't think I'll do mine exactly the same, but it helps idea-wise;
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Nice welds too & I like the Duc seat .
I'm hopeful that the Prolink models have extra frame members at the back (over the twin shocker) that I can more easily tie into for my McGyver mono.
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby NobleHops » Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:06 pm

Oh yeah, that bike is very very cool. I like it. Are there more photos?

For sure, you'll get a lot of help here. Post pictures and keep a journal and you'll have a ton of folks engaged in your project.

Again, welcome!

N.
Nils Menten
Tucson, Arizona, USA

'80 CBX, sort-of restored :-)

http://noblehops.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/The-Not-Restoration-of-My/5334012_jN2Rnx
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby bikeymikey748 » Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:47 pm

Oh yeah, that bike is very very cool. I like it. Are there more photos?


Yup, I thought you'de never ask. What do you think of these ?
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I bet the owner of this one makes all kinds of friends with that exhaust :laughing-rolling:
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby bikeymikey748 » Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:51 pm

With help from a few (you know who you are !) able-bodied souls, work began a few days back.
First up: The BIG STRIP.No suprises, really. Well....each and every one of my intake boots cracked big time. I thought they were holding the carbs kinda TIGHT. A little extra leverage and, "What was that noise ?".
The oil drained clear and crud-free :D

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I figured I'de start with something bite-sized. Leaving the motor in place for the moment I jumped on the carbs.They stripped easily enough, not too bady oxidised on the metal bits, tons of rust in the bowls and the 'T' fittings for the float bowl breathers were dry-rotted. Idle mixture screws were all set differently ( two were very reluctant to back out).
I want to do them a bit different, and so will be painting them (polishing is soooo passe). Here's the masking process begun;

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Fast forward to my surgicaly-clean painting area (thin coating of self-etching primer in place);

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I used some old tubing and a plumber's torch to McGyver new 'T' fittings ( on the left the new bit, right hand is a cracked original);

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Here's one completed carb. A neighbor turned out to be a GREAT connection for stainless fasteners, if you look closely, you'll see the first 'sprinkling' of them . The carbs cleaned up very well, little trace of the 30 years of crud remain :D

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I filed off the 'stakes' of the throttle and choke plate screws. They came out very smoothly, the shafts undamaged. Any recommendations as to whether Loctite red or blue would be best ? Other recommendations ? I won't be re-staking them .
I'm not certain about asking this here, but here goes: Currently the carbs have 105/35, main/idle jets, and shimless needles ( stock, I believe without checking my manual ). I'll be running Emgo pod filters and a DG 6-1. Any suggestions as to jetting ? I remember reading that CBXs ran slightly rich when stock (!!) and the DG recommendations are for no changes. Your input much apreciated.
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby daves79x » Mon Oct 24, 2011 5:23 am

Nice job on the carbs! I wouldn't have the patience to paint them. Use blue Locker and only a tiny drop - it will creep out the shaft and cause it to stick otherwise. For jetting, plan on at least 120 mains and shim the needles .020 inch. You may need to go a bit larger on the mains, but that is a good starting point. They are easier to make jetting changes at least with pods.

Dave
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:08 am

From experience I can tell you individual pods will make your throttle response slower that an air box setup, the CV carbs don't have the vacuum they need to respond and you will have throttle lag and if you ride the twisties thats where it really shows up when you're moderating the throttle at low to mid rev's.

The DG exhaust will just make it worse, that exhaust system hurts midrange power.

If you want to run pods, go with the two carb filters and a Dyno jet kit, the kit has lighter springs, a drill bit to enlarge the hole in the carb slides to make the slides respond quicker and an adjustable needle, the two carb filters help regain some of the lost vacuum by going without an airbox.

Another way to run individual pods is to update to the diaphragm style carbs, most all Japanese bikes went to them by the mid eighties and are dirt cheap on eBay.

Good luck with the build, I'm diggin the frame work on that SPL you posted.
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby bikeymikey748 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:21 am

Thanks for the input. Dynojet Stage 1 kits are readily available, but these don't include springs. I guess Stage 2 kits have springs, but these are impossible to locate.
I don't want to run the stock airbox as the pods offer much better access for jetting, general serviceability ( though I realise there's a price to be paid).
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:31 am

bikeymikey748 wrote:Thanks for the input. Dynojet Stage 1 kits are readily available, but these don't include springs. I guess Stage 2 kits have springs, but these are impossible to locate.
I don't want to run the stock airbox as the pods offer much better access for jetting, general serviceability ( though I realise there's a price to be paid).


You can pick up a set of OEM slide springs and cut one coil off at a time and experiment with them in conjunction with a stage one Dyno kit.
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby daves79x » Mon Oct 24, 2011 5:12 pm

You can actually make the stock carbs run pretty well with pods, without the stage 3 kit. The mistake most guys make is not jetting up enough. If you try to run a stock set of carbs with pods and no jetting changes, it will be down about 20 hp and feel like a weak 650cc bike. Every year of carb is different, so jetting changes vary. The '79 has 98 stock mains and 120 is a good starting point. If the bike staggers off idle and surges at steady throttle, go bigger. At $50 a pop, main sets get expensive, but you have to do this. You can also go up to somewhere in the '70s from the stock 65 primary mains and shim the needles. If the bike runs and responds well after you jet the carbs but your gas mileage is in the low twenties or worse, then you went too rich. You can attain 30mpg or a little better if jetted properly with pods and still have it run pretty well.

If you can get your hands on a stage 3 kit, they work well too, on the '79 carbs. They will be pretty rich, but you have an adjustable needle and you do drill out the vacuum holes a bit. I never saw a stage 3 kit supplied with replacement vacuum springs, and I've installed several kits.

'80 carbs will take at least 130 mains (they have 110 stock) and '81-'82 carbs should be 125s or so (they have 105 stock). This will get you in the close ballpark with pods, no matter the pipe.

I personally don't like the pod filters on a CBX because the carbs are hard to tune, and the intake honk is pretty bad, but a lot of guys want to go that way, so I've had to play around with them and this is what I've found. Jim Z has done extensive dyno work on these set-ups and has had good success jetting with pods, mostly stage 3 kitted.

Dave
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Re: 'Diamond in the rough'

Postby Jeff Bennetts » Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:43 pm

The original stage 3 kits came with lighter springs, Dyno jet still supplies the springs with some of it's current kits for other bikes but not the CBX.

No matter how well you tune a CBX with these old style CV carbs, running the single pods will cause throttle lag, the air box is what helps supply the vacuum and there is just no way around it, I have been running a stage 3 kit on my 79 for twenty years and I'm going back to the airbox for next year.

Dave, take a good look at Jim's podded bikes, the ones I have seen he runs the two carb filters not the singles, he used to sell the two pod per carb setups.
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